FLOT US-NBT Operations (sell side)

[woodstockmerkle]

How about

Feels
Like
Operating
Tier-3

[masterOfDisaster]

Amazingly creative!

[masterOfDisaster]

I’m almost scared by how fast that went.
NuBotput the 10,000 NBT on order (3,000 NBT at a time).
All but 1,000 NBT have already been traded for BTC:

nud getliquidityinfo B | grep BETwD8nSjtj9ADSvej2na34xmsMYwPRymv -A 2
        "BETwD8nSjtj9ADSvej2na34xmsMYwPRymv" : {
            "buy" : 19530.45,
            "sell" : 1000.0

The liquidity overall and on Poloniex is quite balanced at the moment.

I’ve prepared another deposit to the gateway.
Please verify and check, but only sign if the liquidity situation gets dire.
I might not be available on short notice for the next hours. That’s why I prepared it.
Created and signed by @masterOfDisaster.

01000000ae00965602512b78849407bdbfc665c38bded629af3b1fa6395e15f68ccffc0a10cf5c1e7801000000f8004730440220060cba1d5e009c7cf46cb3e42d40d2e9102a18568a6ca96e200e43ad63d8fa2102200b1f7fbe3adb5ea7be9d0e355929bc8ba24c47f5df1fe37fa7c19ad384e32273014cad5321034b0bd0f653d4ac0a2e9e81eb1863bb8e5743f6cb1ea40d845b939c225a1a80ff2102a144af74d018501f03d76ead130433335f969772792ec39ce389c8a2341552592103661a4370dfcfbcea25d1800057220f4572b6eecab95bb0670e8676a9e34451dc210234139729dd413c84a71a0bfd6f236790be861b37311cef3240277c940e4b0c072102547427fc2ea3a0ab9ef70f5e1640ff5112b113f65696948f992bd0770b94257155aeffffffff720edee6987d98ab4cdb768258393730dbff817c3d997e7ce6adc5d28992641d01000000f900483045022100eeea3a801a2a28054f3e1b0cca7678f95f6922cbab29d81d20c6de086de7d5a202200d8ff1e0ad86a734bddcb84dfb20c0f100441737013d1a70c9a27490ad8d9e97014cad5321034b0bd0f653d4ac0a2e9e81eb1863bb8e5743f6cb1ea40d845b939c225a1a80ff2102a144af74d018501f03d76ead130433335f969772792ec39ce389c8a2341552592103661a4370dfcfbcea25d1800057220f4572b6eecab95bb0670e8676a9e34451dc210234139729dd413c84a71a0bfd6f236790be861b37311cef3240277c940e4b0c072102547427fc2ea3a0ab9ef70f5e1640ff5112b113f65696948f992bd0770b94257155aeffffffff0200e1f505000000001976a914c2b412403ce1ed0576eb2318b3ce027bb5a06b0a88acac07f6050000000017a914f35b24f264597d66ba8c366a5005824bb6a06138870000000042

edit:
all NBT on the gateway have been traded. No NBT funds on the gateway are left to support the peg in case the NBT sell side runs dry.
Current liquidity is according to ALix balanced, though.
We need to keep an eye on this.

[masterOfDisaster]

[Passed] Motion to join FLOT - masterOfDisaster

Availability notice: I have been informed that I'll be on a trip from 2016-02-08 to 2016-02-19. Other trips might follow. I will have limited or for some time even no access to the internet. I will not be available on short notice, but hope that I can keep the 36 hours response time.

[henry]

I still hope NuLagoon Tube and other FLOT members can offer a word for the refund of fees and spreads.

Dear FLOT team members,

Sorry for the late response. As you probably know, we are busy to do some final polishing and tunning work to NuLagoon Tube.

@dysconnect has many valid points regarding the refund of fees and spreads. However, we would like to explain a little bit how we see it from our angle.

1. As an exchange, NuLagoon Tube does not have the obligation to balance its buy-sell walls.
2. As a LPC, NuLagoon Pools T3 have the obligation to balance NuLagoon Tube’s buy-sell walls.
3. NuLagoon Pools T3 does not have the obligation to balance itself from T4.
4. T4 Managers have the obligation to balance overall network liquidity, including T1 to T3.

So, balancing Tube could be treated as part of T4 managers’ jobs. It is reasonable that you pay some cost to fulfill your job.

We agree that FLOT could have the refund of half spreads. Because assuming NuLagoon Pools T3 buy some NBT from T4, we will accept the price at $1, however, we don’t think it is reasonable to ask T3 to buy NBT at a premium price, such as $1.002

Regarding transaction fee, because we invest a lot of resource to invent and run the service, it is reasonable to have some revenue by collecting tx fees.

NuLagoon Tube creatively provides a better way for FLOT operations but won’t increase its cost.

1. Minimun time cost and risk. Fund could come back in minutes.
2. Minimun exchange default risk. NuLagoon Tube is backed by NuLagoon Pools, which has part of asset stored offline. Moreover, the monthly custodian fee could be treated as a form of collateral as well.
3. Minimun BTC volitilaty risk, the price is fixed at the moment TubeIn tx is seen.

Is that make sense? Could we agree on that NuLagoon Tube refund half of the spread rate to FLOT in one or two months basis.
Thank you

Henry

[woodstockmerkle]

I think below are the key discussions and motions around NuLagoon.

Things I am pondering:
1- does NuLagoon Tube “as a pool” fall under the scope of the motions below? i.e.: is NuLagoon as an LPC operating on the NuLagoon Tube “exchange” considered a pool operation
2- if so, does the self-governance of balancing between the exchanges apply as a function that NuLagoon must perform?

This will require more thought and discussion, for sure.

Feb 2015

[Passed] Motion to create the first liquidity pool: The Nu Lagoon

Motion RIPEMD160 hash: b5e709a59226b979e4cb59e6d3a3e06b506e3761 Hello everyone, I would like to propose to create and manage the first private funded liquidity group pool: The Nu Lagoon. The Nu Lagoon will contain multiple pools. Different pool has different expected return rate and different risk. It will up to participants to participate which pool. Following are the details. Pool A: Participants Pool A will accept deposit in BTC and NBT. The BTC deposit address is: xxxxx, and NBT de…

April 2015

[Passed] Motion capping NuLagoon fees going forward

Edit The final motion has been posted in this thread here: https://discuss.nubits.com/t/draft-motion-capping-nulagoon-fees-going-forward/1968/6. Please consider voting for the reasons in this thread. Thanks. -End edit- Motion Hash: draft ******BEGIN DRAFT MOTION HASH ON NEXT LINE****** The NuShareholders are becoming increasingly concerned about their limitless exposure in the scope of the liquidity service provisioning and monthly payments in time as result of the passing of motion b5e709…

April 2015

[Voting] The motion of the updated terms between the Nu Lagoon and Nu Shareholders

Motion RIPEMD160 hash: 63da1709b33f8b09c670ea43a15da375eac6a0c5 =##=##=##=##=##=## Motion hash starts with this line ##=##=##=##=##=##= The motion of the updated terms between the Nu Lagoon and Nu shareholders This motion will become effective after the first NuLagoon accounting day on the day this motion passes, and will nullify motion b5e709a59226b979e4cb59e6d3a3e06b506e3761 and ae07a18b22e20e38d6bf7559e320c1728d7a62dc The manager(s) of The Nu Lagoon manage fund provided by pools…

Sep 2015

[Passed] Motion to regulate rules of fund management in NuLagoon

Following the discussion in the thread: Motion RIPEMD160 hash: 1f7223971e026dd124dc1a31ebf548836b73af71 =##=##=##=##=##=## Motion hash starts with this line ##=##=##=##=##=##= We present this motion to NuShareholders. By voting in favor of this motion, you are letting NuLagoon know that the following rules of fund management serve the need of NuNetwork better. The funds placed at Tier 1 will be 10% of the total fund or more. The funds placed at Tier 1 and Tier 2 will be 20% of the tota…

Dec 2015

[Passed] The Nu Lagoon Custodian Fee Request of 26th Nov 2015

Dear Shareholders: With the support and help from the community, the Nu Lagoon has successfully operated for another 4 weeks. As reported in the http://nulagoon.com/data.html , the accumulated Custodian Fee is 1460.648 NBT for Pool A, 3299.352 NBT for Pool C and D till 26th Nov. I would like to request shareholders to grant custodian fee to the pools. BTRnV9uLSPVJw4jn1JMV2Ki2cfFqPYip9o, 4760.00 NBT Thank you in advance. The Nu Lagoon manage team Note: It is Nushareholders' obligati…

[masterOfDisaster]

Thank you for posting the references.
Without much thought I’m inclined to perceive NuLagoon Tube as extra service for which an extra fee is required (I don’t see the capping apply here) if Nu wants to make use of it.

There’s no need for Nu to use it.
But the FLOT might consider it useful, as it provides Nu with a means to move funds from T4 to T3 (and not to T1/T2 like with the gateways!).

I welcome the offer to have a reduced fee for that.

[dysconnect]

I typed a bunch of stuff a couple of hours ago but somehow the draft was gone. Now I’m typing a bunch more but it will be less organized.

Balancing NuLagoon Tube is not our job, but balancing NuLagoon is. Even if we don’t support NuLagoon Tube, we still need to balance NuLagoon. NuLagoon has refused a manual trade with FLOT on the grounds that a purchase can be made on NuLagoon Tube instead, which of course at that time would have costed 0.6%.

There are are times that NuLagoon Tube needs to buy liquidity from Nu, and there are times where Nu wants to help rebalancing NuLagoon. These tend to coincide a lot.

On one hand, if NuLagoon Tube can thrive and even become a market maker, anything we sell you will be resold for a profit, and Nu has no reason to sell cheap liquidity. On the other hand, if NuLagoon is unhealthy it poses a risk to Nu, but that job is already paid for by your management fee. If trading on NuLagoon Tube is to become an integral part of balancing NuLagoon, I have to point out that your business model is already subsidized by Nu.

For example, any BTC sitting on your exchange is supported by liquidity interests. That’s a few thousand NBT invested per month. This is unless you use BTC out of your own pocket, where you get hit by volatility, or invest a lot more and become a generic exchange that accepts traders’ funds. There’s no reason for Nu to pay to refill that BTC.

I also need to point out that NuLagoon Tube has probably diverted funds from Poloniex. It certainly causes some trouble for FLOT and some T3 people, but both FLOT and shareholders would accept that because it’s good for Nu in the long term. I hope all parties can keep proceeding with good will.

I might personally begrudgingly accept that remaining 0.2% until B&C Exchange rolls out; it probably costs lower than $100 a month for a few more months, not even out of my own pocket. On that regard it’s not worth our time to argue for. However, it is a very important precedent to our power balance with parties such as B&C Exchange in the future. Even if we can do it now, we must not do it forever.

[henry]

NuLagoon Tube as extra service

Exactly.
NuLagoon Pools (A,C,D) is a service for NuShareholders and be paid by NuShareholders.
NuLagoon Tube is a service for NBT/BTC traders and be paid by NBT/BTC traders.

NuLagoon has refused a manual trade with FLOT on the grounds that a purchase can be made on NuLagoon Tube instead,

That’s not completely true. The option of manual trading with FLOT is still open, only this option brings much cost and risk to us. Most of time, we can’t respond to the request in time.

Nu has no reason to sell cheap liquidity

Although Nu has some historial record of selling NBT at price below $1, we definitely second this, NBT should be sold exactly at $1, not $0.998 nor $1.002.

it’s not worth our time to argue for

Very true. All of us should focus on how to work together to offer better Nu services to attract more NBT users.

[masterOfDisaster]

Deposit to Poloniex sell side gateway required.
TX created and signed my masterOfDisaster.

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Please verify before proceeding.
Ping @Dhume, @ttutdxh, @jooize, @woodstockmerkle

[jooize]

Verified and signed by masterOfDisaster + jooize.

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Your link is HTTP by the way. @ttutdxh: Please make Cointoolkit force HTTPS for generated links.

[dysconnect]

Verified and signed and broadcast: b830d5710dec6325dd07ae544afac4fd1773872e4bb53978408853193565a3bf

[masterOfDisaster]

Impressive!
Funds almost there:

Currency	Amount	Address	Date	Status
NBT	10000.00000000	BNCaRW9ZjSLeGkwCfMb48izHy2tXLAVR2i	2016-01-15 14:54:53	PENDING (9 of 10 confirmations)

[zoro]

Impressive!

indeed! faster than the Tube!

[woodstockmerkle]

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Signed 2 of 3-of-5 – 20k to the (ab)used gateway

@joozie I moved this here

@Dhume, @ttutdxh, @masterOfDisaster

[masterOfDisaster]

Verified and signed

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

Tried to broadcast it, but I’m not sure whether that worked. Got no feedback from nud.
We will need to check the block explorer.

Signed 2 of 3-of-5 – 20k to the (ab)used gateway

This address really belongs to the sell side gateway. That is no abuse, but intended use
Regarding abuse: I started the buy side gateway once more in “sell side mode” as there are still approximately 2,000 NBT to have a buffer until the 20,000 NBT arrive.

edit: I got feedback from nud (took some time).
tx ID seems to be 5a2ef01f6a6d3585953822a5c16a11163a7b3d90026ac04174b8b835a8da4bac (which can’t be seen yet).

edit2:
buy side gateway in abuse mode up to buffer until the 20,000 arrive at the sell side gateway:

22:55:21.038 [Strategy Secondary Task] INFO  - SELL- OrderBook : ----- SELL-side order book :
1.005999,0.00268919,2006.60946727
SELL wall volume : 2006.60946727
SELL tier2 volume = 0.0 NBT
Total SELL volume = 2006.60946727 NBT
Best price :0.00268919 (1.0059990871$)
SELL balance left = 0.0 NBT-----  [com.nubits.nubot.strategy.Secondary.StrategySecondaryPegUtils:227]
22:55:21.045 [Strategy Secondary Task] INFO  - Trying to place 1 orders... [com.nubits.nubot.strategy.Secondary.StrategySecondaryPegUtils:228]
22:55:22.095 [Strategy Secondary Task] INFO  - SELL wall order updated. ID : 1157125778 size: 2006.60946727 [com.nubits.nubot.trading.TradeUtils:231]
22:55:22.228 [Strategy Secondary Task] WARN  - **SELL** orders re-initialized on  **poloniex** :  1/1 placed successfully
total amount placed : 2006.60946727
Tier1 order size : 2006.60946727
Tier2 cumulative order size : 0.0 (0 orders)
 [c.n.n.s.S.StrategySecondaryPegUtils:246]

[masterOfDisaster]

The tx size is above 1 kB. Shouldn’t that require 0.02 NBT fee?
I can’t find the tx id on blockexplorer…
It’s there:
http://blockexplorer.nu/transactions/5a2ef01f6a6d3585953822a5c16a11163a7b3d90026ac04174b8b835a8da4bac

Redacted some content that would lead to confusion.

update: the funds on the (ab)used buy side gateway are gone. We need a deposit to the sell side gateway soon…

update2:
Just in case it might be required (if the buy side should run dry) I started the buy side gateway in normal (buy side gateway) mode as I’ll be away, like I said…
Can’t let the two gateways run simultaneously - they consume too much RAM together with nud. Sorry.

[cryptog]

update: the funds on the (ab)used buy side gateway are gone. We need a deposit to the sell side gateway soon…

1k sell, 8k buy on polo.

[masterOfDisaster]

Sell side on Polonies is safe for now:

23:19:50.007 [priceTriggerTask] WARN  - Putting a cap on SELL liquidity available. [Total Balance  : 17000 NBT ; capped @  6000.0 NBT] [c.n.n.t.L.LiquidityDistributionModel:85]
23:19:50.012 [priceTriggerTask] INFO  - SELL- OrderBook : ----- SELL-side order book :
1.005998,0.00265631,3000.0
SELL wall volume : 3000.0
SELL tier2 volume = 0.0 NBT
Total SELL volume = 3000.0 NBT
Best price :0.00265631 (1.0059977232$)
SELL balance left = 14000.0 NBT-----  [com.nubits.nubot.strategy.Secondary.StrategySecondaryPegUtils:227]
23:19:50.017 [priceTriggerTask] INFO  - Trying to place 1 orders... [com.nubits.nubot.strategy.Secondary.StrategySecondaryPegUtils:228]
23:19:51.028 [priceTriggerTask] INFO  - SELL wall order updated. ID : 1157483420 size: 3000.0 [com.nubits.nubot.trading.TradeUtils:231]
23:19:52.196 [priceTriggerTask] WARN  - **SELL** orders re-initialized on  **poloniex** :  1/1 placed successfully
total amount placed : 3000.0
Tier1 order size : 3000.0
Tier2 cumulative order size : 0.0 (0 orders)
 [c.n.n.s.S.StrategySecondaryPegUtils:246]

[cryptog]

We have 0 nbt on sales in Polo. We need to send 10k nbt to the sell side of polo.