[Closed] Motion to cease shareholder-funded NBT/PPC operations

[cryptog]

We have now 50,000 NBT worth on NBT/BTC buy wall at CCEDK.

[mhps]

I think the danger is real. The issue should be addressed as soon as possible.

According to this Nu perhaps has several times more in cash than all nubits on offer by custodians. So Nu is quite high above water. But if a lot of vote-generated NBTs start to be ready to enter NBT/crypto market, the situation could change.

edit: I checked proposals of KTM, jmiller, and Jordan’s strategic reserve. These proposals received about 6 millions NBT generated by voting. That exceed the reserve Nu has. I think we should choose to err on the safe side and curb NBT/BTC if the market keeps going down.

That is why offering liquidity on NBT/USD should be the priority over NBT/crypto but the issue is that most of the exchanges in which NBT is traded do not have a large USD volume…

I think selling NBT on payment processor/gateways could be very effective. They are like slightly more traditional version of shapeshift.

[cryptog]

I think selling NBT on payment processor/gateways could be very effective. They are like slightly more traditional version of shapeshift.

Obviously having NBT being sold by a Coinbase is ideal and a natural future step…i believe. Or you could create such a payment processor.

[mhps]

You don’t need to create one. just install a bot on existing ones. it should be simpler than on an exchange.

[cryptog]

These proposals received about 6 millions NBT generated by voting.

Are those 6m in circulation?

How do they compare to the 500k in “Whether we have fractional reserve and what that fraction is depends the value of NuShares + reserves (such as USD, BTC and PPC) / NuBits in circulation. For example, right now NuShares are worth about 3,000,000 NBT, reserves are approximately 600,000 NBT (total of BTC and PPC held by KTm, Julie Miller and myself), and I believe outstanding NBT is around 500,000. 3,600,000 / 500,000 = 7.2”

Outstanding means “in circulation” i assume.

[Cybnate]

There are about 2m in circulation and 4m in a strategic reserve. ( [Passed] Proposal to create a strategic reserve of NuBits )

[cryptog]

There are about 2m in circulation

Do you know what is the difference between those 2m and the 500k mentioned by JL?
Another way to formulate the question is what is the meaning of outstanding in “I believe outstanding NBT is around 500,000”

[Cybnate]

I can only do an educated guess as they are not my words. I think you are right and he meant ‘in circulation’.

[cryptog]

In that case, there is a mismatch between the 500k mentioned by JL and the 2m you are talking about…it seems.

[Cybnate]

.Ok, I need to clarify what I meant. The 2m is for sale in the market right now, of which about 500k has been sold and transferred in ppc and btc holdings.

[cryptog]

Tks for the clarification.
Those 2m must be corresponding to the 2.2m in coinmarketcap. -->$ 2,248,306 .

Anyway, that would be great to have a real-time tool that lets shareholders know how many NBT are for sale…
Perhaps such an information would be included in the tool that was talked about by @ben .
I assume that there is no command in the debug window of the Nu wallet that lets you get to know about that.

[Yurizhai]

I’m assuming the custodian tool will provide us with plenty of information such as that.

[Cybnate]

The new wallet version would be able to take datafeeds. I haven’t seen it yet as it is still being tested, but I know the intention is to inform the shareholders better. @cryptog There is currently no command to obtain that information.

[cryptog]

@Cybnate All right. Tks for the information anyway.

[ttutdxh]

I am a strong supporter of PPC but I have to vote to this motion because of this reasons

[Chronos]

@KTm How much liquidity is currently on CCEDK PPC/NBT pair? At the time this motion was put forward, which was about two months ago, it was about 200000 PPC. Is there still a similar amount on the book now?

[KTm]

@Chronos, as of 20:50 GMT:

// The total amount of liquidity that has been active on that market (total deposits amount minus withdrawals for liquidity balancing and dividends):
191,079.789 NBT

// Amount paid in fees over the life of this market:
(9524.0215 NBT) - Sell-side
(14,398 NBT) - Buy-side

// Total NBT liquidity that should exist after balancing, dividends and fees (assuming no losses due to exchange rate arbitrage or holdings devaluation):
167,157.768 NBT

// Current Account Balance
PPC: 144,971.3698394 PPC (@ 2.049079 = 70,749.3464 NBT)
NBT: 1,179.19155385 NBT

Actual Total: 71,928.53 NBT

---

I’m going to triple check my numbers. But if these hold up (and I believe they will), it is obvious that Peercoin’s price slide from $1.40 (on 22-SEPT-2014) to $0.49 (today) has allowed for significant arbitrage trading and devaluation of holdings.

This is why I have not injected extra sell-side liquidity onto the market since 20-NOV-2014.

//KTm

[Ben]

Damn.

It’s hard to cleanly separate devaluation from capital losses due to arbitrage just looking at that, but I ran a back-of-napkin calculation to see how badly the price slump that PPC has been in has (potentially) hurt.

167,157.768 NBT on September 22, 2014 was worth 119,397 PPC (at $1.40)

167,157.768 NBT on January 8, 2014 is worth 341,138 PPC (at $0.40)

Converted totally to PPC, the current account holdings (at 2.049) are 147,388 PPC.

If nothing changed, and all of those NBT on September 22 had been converted to PPC, we’d be looking at a total account balance of 47,758 NBT. Obviously that’s not a perfect calculation because there’s been ebb and flow to the pricing and all of the NBT wasn’t immediately exchanged for PPC, but it gives a ceiling for how poorly you’d come out holding PPC over the past 3+ months.

My assessment is that it is a devaluation problem more than an arbitrage problem – but with the high volume on that market that has gone on for a while, I’d bet that both are contributing.

[crypto_coiner]

I am a strong supporter of PPC but I have to vote to this motion because of this reasons

Voted for that reason

[crypto_coiner]

Why did the vote hash change?