Thoughts on using Paypal for NBT/USD entry and exit

[nmei]

There’d be a hot and cold wallet. The paypal would be hot wallet. All funds would be immediately shifted to the cold wallet upon receipt.

If the community doesn’t support this with a grant - then there is no risk to the community. So nu would not have any funds at all and the funds would come from outside investment. This would simply be another exchange that everyone should celebrate.

And if we knock out half of the exchange - Nu to USD we don’t need to worry about KYC/AML. But then it isn’t much of an exchange…

[Nagalim]

doesn’t support this with a grant

So where’s the profit? Is the website also charging a trading fee on top of the paypal fee?

cold wallet

Where’s this kept? Another paypal account?

[nmei]

So where’s the profit? Is the website also charging a trading fee on top of the paypal fee?

Correct - there would have to be a fee on top of the paypal fee. The goal would be to keep it minimal - 0.2%. So the total exchange burden would be ~3.1%.

Where’s this kept? Another paypal account?

A US bank. This is how paypal works. It is tied to a bank account.

[Nagalim]

So this is from an interview with @ronny:

CT: You previously noted that your exchange is exploring “many alternative ways of payment through integrated payment service providers.” Could we expect to see something like PayPal being used toward this end in light of their big announcement?

RB: Paypal has been a pain to many merchants, and impossible for exchanges due to the allowed chargebacks, and I am sure this will continue, so we will try to see if we can get Paypal for our withdrawal procedures and forget all about deposit, similar to credit cards, as they are also accepting chargebacks which is a potential killer for business. Everybody considers Paypal a big player in the market, and they are of course. It’s just that if we can’t use [it] 100%, and the fact that they have shown before that they are ready to freeze accounts if they deem it necessary, what is the purpose then?

@nmei How does what you’re proposing get around these issues, and why is CCEDK not already doing it?

[nmei]

One of the simpler ways of using fiat is using paypal. But using paypal for BTC conversion is not viable because of fraudulent claims and lack of proof of payment. The same issues arise when we talk about NBT.

However, there is a way around this: sell website credits which are redeemable for NBT or USD. The credits are traceable and enable proof of purchase.

Please see: https://www.virwox.com/
They have been taking paypal for virtual currency for years. Innumerable other sites allow you to buy site credits. Look at the market for WoW gold - all enabled by paypal. This is no different. The site is selling credits, not crypto.

[Dhume]

My apologies if I bring up something already discussed, but aren’t there payment services that allow one to sell and buy goods with fiat but use BTC as actual payment? Aka person X buys or sells Y amount of Nubits for 500 USD and we get 500 USD in BTC instead (aka the middleman instantly uses the USD to buy BTC worth of 500 USD and transfers the BTC). If we used such a service we could set up our own Nubit web shop for buying and selling Nubits without the need for bank accounts or PayPal.

[nmei]

@Dhume This is about fiat. What is needed is a fiat gateway.

[Dhume]

Not sure if we understand each other, but you want a place where customers can go to directly purchase or sell Nubits from Nu right? The problem is that we can’t use fiat but using a middleman enables customers to use fiat while we keep using BTC.

[nmei]

Not from Nu. I just want to see an exchange where people can easily exchange fiat for NBT (and vice versa) without having to use wire transfer.

[Nagalim]

That’s what dhume is saying. Customer pays USD, gets NBT. Nu pays NBT, gets BTC. Third party trades the USD for BTC for Nu.

[nmei]

How would people buy NBT with USD without paypal - or other payment gateway?

I understand exchanging NBT and providing BTC instead of USD which would relieve the burden of storing USD in paypal or a bank.

However I think people still want an easy way to get fiat out…without having to go coinbase, bitstamp, and wait for wire, ACH, SEPA, etc.

[Dhume]

My apologies if I bring up something already discussed, but aren’t there payment services that allow one to sell and buy goods with fiat but use BTC as actual payment? Aka person X buys or sells Y amount of Nubits for 500 USD and we get 500 USD in BTC instead (aka the middleman instantly uses the USD to buy BTC worth of 500 USD and transfers the BTC). If we used such a service we could set up our own Nubit web shop for buying and selling Nubits without the need for bank accounts or PayPal.

Personally I feel (I’m pretty sure I also suggested it) this would be a very smart move for Nu and I hope one that is takes before B&C Exchange go’s live. It would enable us to provide customers with the ability to converse fiat without the need for external exchanges and would make it easier for customers to trade at B&C Exchange.

[Dhume]

I think there are several providers of this service, one is https://www.bitwage.com/

https://www.bitpagos.com/en/ provides a similar service.

[dysconnect]

I already have a hard time accepting 0.2% per trade charged by KYC exchanges that don’t insure deposits.

Paypal? It is both expensive and unreliable. Basically we pay a huge premium for them to shove all risks and liability up our own asses. Anything we don’t like about banks is twice as worse with Paypal.

[Dhume]

Googling a bit but it seems we could do the same with https://www.okpay.com this would enable us to accept a shitload of payment options (https://www.okpay.com/en/business/accepting-payments/) and then withdraw the proceedings in BTC if I’m correct.

I don’t know what kind of premiums above companies charge for all of this though.

[huafei]

perfectmoney and okpay is best than paypal

[nmei]

@henry @Dhume
RE: okpay, perfectmoney
I understand but residents of the US cannot use either.

@dysconnect
RE: paypal fees…
I understand and agree completely. Paypal is a pain! But give me another option for US residents that can enable the quick processing of fiat in and out?

[huafei]

sorry lr was down by fbi

[desrever]

relevant -> [Passed] Promoting Nubits to internet payment processors, exchanges, and gateways

[mhps]

relevant -> [Passed] Promoting Nubits to internet payment processors, exchanges, and gateways

Thanks for bringing it up. Don’t reinvent the wheels. Fiat PEGs (payment processors, currency exchangers, and payment gateways) have been thought about worked on. Keep it going and continue discussion in those threads.

I think deep NBT/fiat liquidity held by many for-profit-and-profitable PEGs is the ultimate way for Nu to florish.