[Passed] NuRiver Cryptsy Month 2 Operations

[Cybnate]

Ok, I’ll lower it and set both to 4000.

Ok and given the discussion about lowering liquidity costs. Did you notice that both NuPool and LiquidBits lowered their rates for LPs on all pairs? May I suggest you go with that too, not sure why Cryptsy should have higher rates than e.g. Poloniex, but maybe you do have a good rational for that?

[nmei]

I can see lowering to 0.25% for BTC.
I would lower the USD to 0.18% BUT raise the tolerance to 3% simply due to the cost of doing business on the fiat pairs on cryptsy.

Updated the main post. Time to vote.
The ONLY reason this is for 30 days is because I want to change to @Nagalim’s fixed rate pool. And I’m hoping one month will give enough time to shake out the bugs.

[Nagalim]

A 3% tolerance on that pair is basically a 6% SAF. It’s an interesting perspective to look at SAF as a means of offsetting rebalance costs, as it was originally meant for volatility costs. I’d question the effectiveness of such a method as only one trade might happen between rebalancing, whereas volatility can cause many trades to happen at a spread, thereby amplifying the effect of SAF.

I ask you to consider the end user. Would you want to trade nbt on cryptsy if you knew you’d have to pay 3% to sell for USD, then another big % to withdraw?

If you want to offset the 0.5% nbt withdrawal fee with a ~0.7% tolerance, I’d support that.

Sorry I didn’t catch it before you hashed it. 3% is a lot, you’d be swimming in uncharted territory. Not that that’s a bad thing, necessarily…

[nmei]

USD withdrawal is a different beast on Cryptsy. It’s not the simple 0.5%…I can speak from experience. Once you have USD you’re stuck unless you do one of 3 things.

1. Change to BTC, which carries a 3%+ cost due to the illiquid premium market
2. Withdraw to another e-wallet that you have to setup which is more hassle and a 1% fee. Not to mention the wire fees after that.
3. Withdraw to a physical check which takes 3-5 business days to get to you

SO, USD on cryptsy is a hassle. Passing the 3% to the end user saves Nu network from the cost. Plus 3% is comparable to the BTC/USD premium that they are already paying. I’d be willing to lower it to 2% though, but the motion is out???

[Nagalim]

But both the LP and the end user have to pay the USD withdrawal, and that is not really unique to Cryptsy. We are trying to provide a service such that users with USD don’t have to pay that very fee, but can instead trade for USD and withdraw that. The LPs are paid by Nu enough to offset the withdrawal fee if they are trying to rebalance. Maybe not, like I said it’s an interesting perspective and I’m not completely convinced it’s wrong, I just question the efficiency of it. You can try to pass this grant as is for a test run if you like. Besides, maximizing the offset is not necessarily the best LP strategy and you may find your LPs using offsets significantly less than the allowed tolerance. It’s an interesting experiment, for sure.

[zoro]

an experiment indeed. the usd in cryptsy has more difficulties since you have to be authenticated with a picture and official documents. Cryptsy lacks the different authentication levels that other exchanges have!

p.s. i see a “big” rise in BTC’s value but NU’s buy side is not shrinking, i wonder!

[nmei]

We will see.

I can tell you there are only 2 providing USD liquidity - and I am one. And there is no NBT. I’m not compensated by Nu enough to re-balance as it stands, which is why everything is setting in USD. It would take ~15 days to make 3% to cover the cost of making the USD -> BTC -> NBT re-balance. Or wait the 5-7 days for a check and then use coinbase BTC -> NBT.

[Nagalim]

I see, basically every alt-coin on cryptsy is trading for more than the coinmarketcap average. Maybe you should consider modifying the price feeds to have a local offset, such that NBT is worth $1.01 instead of $1, then have a smaller tolerance. This is equivalent to an asymmetric tolerance. It would require a change in both the client and the server and would result in something like a buy wall at $1 and a sell wall at $1.02. This would not require any change to the BTC pool, only the USD pool.

The fundamental issue here is that if NBT had existed when cryptsy started operation it wouldn’t have gotten this bad. But as is, you’re basically attempting to provide an arbitrage gateway for the entire exchange.

I can hard code some changes to the client, but it would break the other pools unless I do some labor intensive wiring out of parameters. I can easily make you a branch of my github specifically for NuRiver NBT/USD though.

[cryptog]

I suggest we hold a bit supporting liquidity operations on cryptsy given their unclear situation.
Plus we have already a good liquidity scattered over several exchanges, I am feeling:{“blocks”:561218,“buy”:113501.0792,“sell”:119643.7158}

EDIT: Well the more liquidity the better although we should limit the costs.

[Cybnate]

Supporting this as it is a relatively small grant and still partially experimental given the issues we have seen on Cryptsy.
I think it is good to have good, but small liquidity spread over many exchanges over having 1 or 2 major ones.

[Cybnate]

[nmei]

I re-applied because I thought the consensus agreed with Cybnate: solid small spread over many exchanges is the goal.
This is only ~354 NBT compared to the thousands spent on the other LPs.
And to address your concerns I won’t look to raise limits and look to decrease rates next month.

[cryptog]

Got it. Makes sense. Will vote for it very soon.

[cryptog]

3f252703ed50366011110a827bceb6fab1494685 verified

and

Custodial Address: BSQSc3WSCxyGUSqETCo8zceADeqx3Dq33x
Amount Requested: 354 NBT

voted

[crypto_coiner]

Custodial Address: BSQSc3WSCxyGUSqETCo8zceADeqx3Dq33xAmount Requested: 354 NBT

ok -voted

[CoinGame]

[Nagalim]

@nmei what are your plans for a logo and website?

[nmei]

Simple website with just the HowTo to get going on the LP.
I have no idea on a logo except the water theme. Any ideas?

[Nagalim]

Get a graphic designer for your logo, shareholders will pay (~$100-150).

[willy]

Yes, NuPool hired a designer as well. We paid him from the operator fees, not through a separate grant.